I have followed this debate with a lot of interest but it is not easy to stay quiet in the face of indirect mobilization of people to do harm to others and themselves. Many people may shy away from this topic or address it superficially of falsely because of societal prejudice.
What did we know of gays, homosexuals, transgender etc while growing up in our villages and towns in
Why all these ‘kill them, exterminate them, don’t allow them, the bible said……, God said….., nature said……. etc’ that is going on in our communities now? The rat said that he is not annoyed with the person who hit him with a broom as he is with those who were shouting “don’t allow him to escape”. We should rethink and moderate our words. i.e the weight and influence they might have on others.
This brings to mind the killing of twins and other little complications our level of scientific knowledge couldn’t arrive at until the missionaries arrived. Who would have convienced our ‘ignorant’ grand parents that they weren’t defending nature and the laws set by God. ‘……..A WOMAN SHOULD GIVE BIRTH TO ONLY A CHILD AND NO MULTIPLE GESTATIONS LIKE GOATS…….’ These were considered words of God because 98% of the populace did so.
My auntie told me that when they were kids their neighbour had a son very normal and very lively, but they noticed that he was using more his left hand so they hung a stone on that left hand so that he would not use it as it was clear the child was becoming left handed; something not still accepted in many Nigerian cultures. The kid used his right hand and my auntie told us that the very boy at a point became strange and was always strange, did not associate with people and spoke rarely to anyone. When he grew up at about the age of 22 he committed suicide. I do not want too much psychology but any reader will understand the role suppression and psychological repression played here.
The writer from
Following some of your debates one will even attribute it to God. I do not think that God will punish my father for opening the earlobes of my sisters for the ear rings nor put him in hell fire for circumcising his male children, with the accusation of changing what he GOD has created. Nobody told God how to create him but the society decides who stays in the society; is this against Gods wish? Some people are born genius and some imbeciles; the society takes the genius and the imbecile is condemned to death in one way or the other according to the social education of the populace. How do we put Gods wish here. Why are there less imbeciles, down syndrome persons etc in our Nigerian society? Someone opined that we are more blessed than the Oyibo people who he claims indulge in many unnatural activities. We all know the truth; they are either put to death knowingly or unknowingly in our society. You may see cases of children with such syndromes in many educated/schooled families in
Every religion is claimed to condemn homosexuality. This is alright and true. My preacher in Nigeria whenever he comes in and sees my girlfriend in trousers was always fast in showing me where it is written in the bible that men should not wear clothes of women or the other way round (pardon but I cannot remember that verse). I do not know if that portion is still in the holy book. I do not intend to blaspheme anyway. I had always pointed out to him that Jesus (from the images were made to see and believe) never wore trousers i.e men’s cloth but attires I as a Nigerian may associate with women’s dresses ). Therefore, that the application of that verse is relative and may still change with time and places. Don’t remind me I know “….everything will change but the words of God will remain……” this is also somewhere, but I cannot remember…….heeelp!!! This is just a little insight into how things can change or applications may vary.
Why are we intolerant to things we do not understand instead of getting to know what and why it is happening? Why do we see homosexuals as evil and never wonder if the other person is thinking the same of us who may still be the majority? How have we transformed ourselves to ‘super beings’ quasi gods capable of assigning and interpreting feelings?
I will stop here because I may be having inspection in the office.
Later I will say something of my working experience with homosexuals, Tran’s genders, prostitutes etc.
Charles Okey.C
(Roma-Italia)
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13 comments:
Very Interesting.
We are waiting for the completion
Andy
I always appreciate people that don't hide themselves behind fake moralism and hypocrisy.
Looking forward to read the second part.
The tittle of this article may be misleading. I have not properly appraised most recent debates against the official emergence of gays in Nigeria Church but will be doing that as soon as possible.
However, I guess nobody is calling for mass murder of gays but it will be absurd to support or promote any importation of immoral ideas to third world countries. It is wrong to think that Western society is the yardistck for measuring what is right or wrong morally .
Homosexuality tends to be a discovery not sexuality. People who engage in it sometimes have got odd stories in their lives ranging from abuse, influence, inability to interact properly with opposite sex or the desire to experience something new.
Consequently, I will not support harming any individual, I will forever make it clear that homosexulity is part of decayed civilization being dumped in africa like the West are dumping other unused things in Africa. Open gay parade in Nigeria is an invitation to recruit innocent vulnerable poor Nigerian youths thereby spreading HIV more rapidly.
Anterus
From Wikipedia on homosexality
in Africa
Though often ignored or suppressed by European explorers and colonialists, homosexual expression in native Africa was also present and took a variety of forms. Anthropologists Stephen Murray and Will Roscoe reported that women in Lesotho engaged in socially sanctioned "long term, erotic relationships," named motsoalle.[30] E. E. Evans-Pritchard also recorded that male Azande warriors (in the northern Congo) routinely took on boy-wives between the ages of twelve and twenty, who helped with household tasks and participated in intercrural sex with their older husbands. The practice had died out by the early 20th century, after Europeans had gained control of African countries, but was recounted to Evans-Pritchard by the elders he spoke to.[31]
Dear Mr Anterus
please read this article about homosexuality in Africa:
Some people believe homosexuality is an idea brought [to Africa] by the white man. But it has always been here. What the white man brought was homophobia clothed in religious doctrines that we did not have before." That's the voice of Donna Smith, the head of the Forum for the Empowerment of Women, as quoted in a Mail & Guardian article on gay life in South Africa today, where fear and violence are common. Read Mail & Guardian article...
A GLBTQ encyclopedia article by sociologist Stephen O. Murray on pre-independence sub-Saharan Africa says: "There is now a belief that homosexuality is a decadent, bourgeois Western innovation forced upon colonial Africa by white men, or, alternately, by Islamic slave-traders. The belief of many Africans that homosexuality is exogenous to the history of their people is a belief with real social consequences [but] not, however, based on serious inquiry, historical or otherwise." Read "The Myth of Exclusive Heterosexuality..."
Dear All,
"The issue is not, and will never be a child's play. We are facing an upheaval that will challenge the conscience of people who think in Nigeria. I see the issue as one of moral dilemma" - Jerry
I was wondering if and how to react to this gay or homosexuality question, when two contributions awakened me from my slumber. The first was by Corneluus in NIGERIAN_DIASPORA@ yahoogroups. com and the second was by our indefatigable Jerry. I must say that for once in a long time, I did enjoy Jerry’s piece. It was very concise and straight to the point. Jerry, thanks for keeping this contribution very brief.
I hope I would also be very brief myself on this occasion. I respect the feelings of Okwuruoha, Chief Martin and our dear Philo but I prefer the more cautious position of Jerry on this matter. I must admit that the issue of homosexuality was one of my cultural shocks when I visited the US for the first and only time, so far, 1992/93, during my Fulbright year. While at Stanford University I was inundated with debates on the rights of homosexuals in some of the Campus newspapers. I recall a particular case of a Senior Faculty, a lady, who was fighting the University authorities for not allowing her “domestic partner” ( a term I heard for the first time then) to borrow books from the library, as was the case with Faculty spouses.
I got interested on the issue of homosexuality and read a few works on it. My interest was on the scientific basis of sexual orientation. In the end, I was left very confused; and I’m still very confused. In general the impression that I gained was/is that the West wants us to believe that sexual orientation is inborn, very much as being left-handed or right-handed is said to be inborn, regardless of cultural, religious or social attitude towards it. Is this really the case? Here I would like to be more educated by scientists – geneticists, biologists or whichever scientists are more competent. Religious dogmas would not be enough.
Before this contribution, I checked from Google to find out how many countries have now legalized same sex marriage. I found out that starting from Netherlands in 2003, Canada, Belgium, Norway, Spain and, hold your breath, SOUTH AFRICA, have followed suit. In the case of the US, because of their federal system, same sex marriages are legal only in the States that have adopted it. So far, these include California, Vermont, New Jersey, Connecticut, New York and Massachusetts. Apart from outright legalization, many other countries have laws permitting same sex “partnerships” or “unions”, whatever that means. My understanding of the latter is that though gay partners may not be regarded as married couples, they have the right to live as couples without any legal sanctions. I counted about 14 countries in this category, including Denmark, France, Mexico, Switzerland and UK.
What is the lesson from all this? Simple: that regardless of one’s attitude towards it, the practice of homosexuality has indeed jumped out of the closet and may sooner or later spread openly to the whole world. When in 1932, Aldous Huxley wrote his famous or infamous novel, “Brave New World” where he suggested that future children would be manufactured in the laboratories, it might have sounded like scientific fiction. Today, with cloning and artificial insemination, what can one say about Huxley’s prediction? In fact I would suggest that in this matter of homosexuality and in the words of Huxley, we better be prepared to “BRAVE NEW WORLD”.
Mike Maduagwu
Dear Mike;
Thanks for your wise contribution. I am almost sure you did not read my piece on the blog. You may follow these links to read the comments of others. I also took the liberty to publish you comment for the readership of many who visit the blog. I suppose you accept that.
http://chukbyke.blogspot.com/2008/09/holocaust-for-nigerian-gays.html
http://chukbyke.blogspot.com/2008/09/as-gay-church-arrives-nigeria.html
I hope my UMUNNA will not banish me for my opinion; but they should wait for the conclusion.
I think it is our duty to educate,prepare,'younger' ones on many issues especially in this era of modern 'virtual normadism' i.e staying in one place and knowing almost exactly what is happening in distant places.
During the last summer holiday with 30 African kids, I was asked hundreds of questions on Africa and Nigeria in particular by kids that had never been to Africa. Some even ventured into tough debates with me. They came to get all those info through the media, internet etc (VIRTUAL NORMADSIM) , therefore we 'grownups' must also get ready some answers for a lot of questions ;thus these debates.
You can also see some of the research posted by Lucy ferroli and Simona in the blog.
Thanks once more.
Charles
@anonymous; I am coming.
@simona, A gloden fish connot hide
@Anterus. There is no cause for alarm ; but I can really see you missed a lot of comments on the debate,you may read the comments here
http://chukbyke.blogspot.com/2008/09/as-gay-church-arrives-nigeria.html
and in some Nigerian dailies.
@Lucy:your prompt research is great.
I shall be concluding soon
Okey.chukbyke C
My dear Charlie,
You are right. I missed that your excellent piece on this sensitive matter. Thanks for linking me up to it. You said it all: we should be slow in condeming what we do not know. How insightful - reminding us of the killing of twins and forcing left-handed kids into becoming right-handed and all that. I'm happy that , though written independently, our contributions have several meeting points. Keep on with your good work.
Mike Maduagwu
Good morning Prof. I also wish and hope specialists with some sort of scientific explanations will give some light or insight.
Charles.
We do ourselves a disservice when we stubbornly refuse to not only acknowledge, but try to understand that which is 'different'.
The truth is God made all people in his wonderful image. Who are we to divine why He made some of us one way or another?
We all simply need to relax. there are bigger issues to deal with than trying to limit the rights and freedoms of specific people. And for all of us Xtians, Jesus clearly said "Let he without sin,cast the first stone." We must learn tolerance or we will never know peace.
Wonderful post, thank you so much for sharing your thoughts.
NIGERIAN CURIOSITY
IT WAS SO MUCH EASIER WHEN I ONLY HAD ONE...
@SOLOMONSYDELLE; thanks for passing by. i replied yours on Ja funmi on the other blog:
---------------------------------
Ja funmi? I do not even know what it says but I like Ade, Obe, Barrister etc they sometimes electrify someones feelings and the little interpreted for me were wise words.
Funmi = give me- I suppose: i had a friend called funmilayo ; she is igbo though from Yoruba loving parents:something rare in our present Nigeria.
I appreciate your post Chukwubike. It is simple and straight to the point. Perhaps we should remind Nigerians that a coup was staged with the motive of riding the Nigerian military of homosexuality. People make me feel they never heard of the word before.
There are many other facts in the bible that has changed with time. Heaven and earth will pass away, the only word that will remain forever is that of Jesus who show every sense of inclusiveness, tolerance, understanding of human nature and absolute love in all aspects of his practice except when dealing with the hypocrites and cheats who abound in Nigeria and among we Nigerians.
Homosexuality is a reality in every society. Unfortunately, Nigerians pay less attention to feelings and scientific analysis of life situation. We shy away from discussing human sexuality and yet we are fornicators and adulterers. We abuse kids sexually in the name of early marriage. But we better not talk about it.
More and more people in the LGBT community are coming out in Nigeria and outside who are Nigerians. Visit Nigerian gay on yahoo to face the reality of this fact.
For those who are looking for recent scientific proves, I refer them to this two recent publications. http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn9413-male-sexuality-may-be-decided-in-the-womb.html
http://www.newser.com/story/27837/homosexuality-its-perfectly-natural.html
But remember that a lot of politicking goes into affirming scientific discoveries. Remember Galileo Galilee (15 February 1564 – 8 January 1642) he was in a big pot of okra soup for challenging the wildly believed view that the earth is the center or our universe. (Heliocentric against geocentric theory of solar system) excuse my history of geography. Both Copernicus and Galileo suffered for advancing this theory. But they were not the first to make this observation but the first to boldly present it to the political power of their time which was Catholic Church.
But my reality is that, I have journeyed all my life with full awareness of my sexual differences, I am not heterosexual, I am homosexual, and I toyed with bisexuality to conform but with no success. I am not up to force my sexual reality on anyone; let no one force his on LGBT.
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